Stock bottom end on B20/vtec

Going-West

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That seems pretty reasonable...what kind of pistons are you getting for $350?
 

FRODO

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Rex_89 said:
This is a quote I got from a local shop. This is if I buy all these parts through them except the ECU because I already have one. And have them put it all together so I go drive home in a B20vtec.

Rod bolts = $40
Head Gasket = $50 - $80
Jumper Harness = $130
B16 to B20 kit = $100
GSR Belt = $50
GSR Water Pump = $120
GSR Oil Pump = $120
Pistons = $350 + $120 installation
Valves resurfaced and an angle job = $200
310 injectors = $200

Labor = $1,000.

Total = 2,480 - 2,510

And thats not including tuning. Or other parts like piston rings, fuel pressure regulator, or if I want adjustable cam gears.

Does that seem a little expensive?
That doesnt seem to bad. But you are missing some key parts and info. What brand Pistons and Injectors? Why not just use some DSM blues to save on cost. And i would highly recommend some Rods and to have the crank balanced and knifed. And dont forget the ARP rod bolts they will be a life saver.

Is this going to be NA or Boost?
 


vandynamics

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There is so much misinformation in this thread it makes me want to puke. You can take a stock bottom b20v safetly to about 7,300-7,400. With arp rod bolts your looking at about 8,300-8,400 rpm (huge difference considering those rpms is where the vtec heads make the power.) The problem is, that it requires your to take down the whole block in order to put just some rod bolts in properly.

Any b18/b20 OBD2 block has the exact same oil pump as the vtec counterparts. I've verified this by calling a dealership and checking part numbers on a b18b and a b18c1 (exact same same part number.) Vtec water pump is somthing you dont need but I recommend. I would not build a frank motor without the proper water pump.

Stock injectors work fine. I have tuned my motor out using high fuel pressure to keep the duty cycle down and I have NEVER had a problem. You have to remember that the injectors on an LS/GSR are the exact same injectors as the ones on the b18c5. They work well.

Depending on which block you choose you will have to route some PCV lines to relieve the 2.0vtec of its incredible crankcase pressures. This is another peices part that adds to the total sum of "reliability"

My frank is one of the most dependable motors i have ever built. Simply take your time and it will treat you well for years to come.
 

Rex_89

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Thanks everyone for your opnions. I am going N/A. At least for now. I dont have any plans on going turbo, but who knows. Maybe somewhere down the line.

Heres the thing. I could either go with pretty much just a stock B20/vtec where I dont think I would have to do too much, or I can go ahead and by my friends ITR cams. If I do that, i've been told I would have to upgrade valve springs, and that I would probably wanna get some different pistons. And if I do that, im going to want to shopeen the rods or get new ones. And that I might as well replace the crank with a GSR one since its coming out. And then im going to want new injectors as well.

Does all that seem accurate?
 


Rex_89

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Heres a pic of the bottom of my head that I just picked up. Im not too familiar on how the valves should look. Do these just need to be resurfaced or do I need new ones?.......

1

2

3

4


What do you think?
 

KScivic

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Wow, buy new valves, have the head hot tanked or at least steam cleaned...
 

FRODO

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And get it milled. You dont have to upgrade your valve train with CTR/ITR cams it will not hurt to but you dont have to.
 

vandynamics

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FRODO said:
And get it milled. You dont have to upgrade your valve train with CTR/ITR cams it will not hurt to but you dont have to.
NO dont mill it if your running stock block.
 

vandynamics

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Rex_89 said:
Heres a pic of the bottom of my head that I just picked up. Im not too familiar on how the valves should look. Do these just need to be resurfaced or do I need new ones?.......

1

2

3

4


What do you think?
that head looks very similar to one of the gsr heads i did some work on. careful with those valves. dont use a screwdriver on them either. if the screwdriver slips and scores the combusion chamer you might be prone to detonation via hotspot.

here let me dig up some pics of how my head looks after i bead blasted the valves, lapped them into the head, and threw some fresh internals in.










^ perfectly lapped valve.

come to think of it. this above head looked much worse then the head you have. im running it on a 2.0 block now and after 40,000 miles it still holds 225 per cylinder PERFECTLY across the board :word:
 

Billy.

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Going-West said:
Heres a dyno of a b20/vtec with a b16 head. The block is stock, but it's got a lot of mods:
AEM Short Ram Intake, DC 4-1 Header, RS-R Header-Back Exhaust, Stock B20 Bottom, PURE Tuning Spec B Cylinder Head, Stock B16A Head Internals /Cams / Intake Manifold / TB, Hondata P28 -PURE TUNED



As you can see, it's pointless to rev past 7000.
that dyno run looks weird, this was my dyno when the b20vtec was BONE STOCK. i stopped pulling at 7k because we were tuning for a lower vtec changeover, but yes it doesnt gain hp after about 7200-7300rpm, no point in reving higher but i think the block is safe for 7500rpm

 

whit3b0y

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Rex_89 said:
This is a quote I got from a local shop. This is if I buy all these parts through them except the ECU because I already have one. And have them put it all together so I go drive home in a B20vtec.

Rod bolts = $40
Head Gasket = $50 - $80
Jumper Harness = $130
B16 to B20 kit = $100
GSR Belt = $50
GSR Water Pump = $120
GSR Oil Pump = $120
Pistons = $350 + $120 installation
Valves resurfaced and an angle job = $200
310 injectors = $200

Labor = $1,000.

Total = 2,480 - 2,510

get arp head studs =50$
commetic head gasket=80$
b16tob20 kit 150$
any obd2 water oil pump is the same as the type r so pointless to buy new one=04
310-440 injectors=250$
pvc system=15-200$
hondata s300=900$
tune=300$

do it yourself=0$

total=2400.00 and it will last cause it has been tuned. with room for expantion

stock head gasekt will not work. you need the golden eagle crvkit for the oillines and the dowl pins. you will need to tune it cause the 310s will be too sufficient at the bottom end will need to be tuned

just my thoughts through my experiance.
 

vandynamics

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stock bottom = stock injectors, i will argue this until the end of time. not to mention my years of tuning and building experiance.

but 95% of this website doesnt understand injector fundamentals. they just think "well if it says vtec i MUST need rc 700cc injectors"

/rant
 

12.8:1 Ls/vtec

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Well, everyone speaks of their "experiance"=???


Experience=Experience as a general concept comprises knowledge of or skill in or observation of some thing or some event gained through involvement in or exposure to that thing or event. The history of the word experience aligns it closely with the concept of experiment.

The concept of experience generally refers to know-how or procedural knowledge, rather than propositional knowledge. Philosophers dub knowledge based on experience "empirical knowledge" or "a posteriori knowledge". The interrogation of experience also has a long tradition in continental philosophy. The German term Erfahrung, which is translated as 'experience' into English has, however, a slightly different implication, given that it is associated with the coherency of life's experiences.

A person with considerable experience in a certain field can gain a reputation as an expert.


, Or just talk too much.
 

vandynamics

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12.8:1 Ls/vtec said:
Well, everyone speaks of their "experiance"=???


Experience=Experience as a general concept comprises knowledge of or skill in or observation of some thing or some event gained through involvement in or exposure to that thing or event. The history of the word experience aligns it closely with the concept of experiment.

The concept of experience generally refers to know-how or procedural knowledge, rather than propositional knowledge. Philosophers dub knowledge based on experience "empirical knowledge" or "a posteriori knowledge". The interrogation of experience also has a long tradition in continental philosophy. The German term Erfahrung, which is translated as 'experience' into English has, however, a slightly different implication, given that it is associated with the coherency of life's experiences.

A person with considerable experience in a certain field can gain a reputation as an expert.


, Or just talk too much.
is this post necessary?
 


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