HID Kelvin Temperature EXPLAINED by a cinematographer

[lagunak47]

Hello all!
I am currently a film major here at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. I work and plan on making a living being a cinematographer. Everything I've been seeing on what ratings you should get for your HID's seem misguided.
Kelvin is the measurement of the color of light (basically). I will break down kelvin rating into commonly used lighting scenarios. To start we must pick a temperature as our base or WHITE. We typically see something as white when it is around 5600k. This is because daylight (sunlight) is rated at 5600k, and it is the ONLY natural light source. So then...

7000 and up - Rarely appear in nature, northern lights are 10,000k (Very blue light)
6000k - Sun (on overcast day)
5600k - Sun (at noon on clear day)
4200k - Fluorescent lighting
3200k - Tungsten lighting (typical orange house lights / car head lights)
1600k - Candle light

as you notice the lower the number the warmer the light, the higher the number the cooler the light. So if you want to see what color your HIDs will be go look at the real world examples of the same color light and compare it to 5600k (overhead daylight)

Here is an example with my car


notice the color of the daylight outside (COLOR OF LIGHT, NOT HOUSES) it is WHITE. Then look at the WARM fog lights (3200k) and the COOL headlights (8000k HIDs)
.
Once you start looking at how light changes color you will understand the kelvin ratings. Unfortunatly this is difficult because our brains rapidly adjust to see whatever light is in front of us as white. However once you become aware of this, and really start to notice the changes it becomes easy to evaluate light.

Hope this helps.

 

[JohnS.]

7000 and up - Rarely appear in nature, northern lights are 10,000k (Very blue light)
6000k - Sun (on overcast day)
5600k - Sun (at noon on clear day)
4200k - Fluorescent lighting
3200k - Tungsten lighting (typical orange house lights / car head lights)
1600k - Candle light

Those seem slightly off to me, maybe by 500-1000. I've read different #'s elsewhere before.

It's weird how our brains interpret things differently than they really are. I have 5k HID's and it looks nothing like the sun to me. It looks blue, especially when coming down the road (when above the cut off) and moreso when they're first turned on and warming up. 4100-4300 is the brightest possible for HID's and looks more like the sun than 5k.

Weird stuff indeed. Thanks for the post!

 

[Billy.]

I think its funny that 3200K is called warm, and 8000K is cool since K is a temperature value

Here's a nice pic to help your thread:

 

[itsmycookie]

Actual Info on Kelvins and brightness

Kelvin (K) A basic unit of thermodynamic temperature (color temperature) used to measure the whiteness of the light output. The higher the number is, the whiter the light is. When over 5000K the light begins to turn to blue as daylight.

The color temperature is purely a scale to measure the color of the light output.

Degrees Kelvin = ONLY COLOR

The reality is the higher up the scale, the less bright they become.

Lumen= BRIGHT

Color Temperature: 3000K (fog light use)

3000K has an approximately 3200lm output, which is more than 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

3000K emits GOLDEN YELLOW color and offers superior penetration power during adverse weather epically in dense fog.

Color Temperature: 4300K

4300K has an approximately 3200lm output, which is more than 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and is the color temperature with the most output.

The light appears fairly white, and has light yellowish hue when reflected off the road identical to the OEM HID equipped vehicles.

Color Temperature: 6000K

6000K has an approximately 2800lm output, which is 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and slightly less light output compared to the 4300K.

Although it has a bit lesser light output, it emits pure whiter light with very slight and barely noticeable tint of blue and purple.

Color Temperature: 8000K

8000K has an approximately 2550lm output, which is about 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and slightly less light output compared to the 6000K.

While it has a bit lesser light output, it emits bluer light than the 6000K.

Color Temperature: 10000K

10000K has an approximately 2200lm output, which is more than 2x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

10000K produces a deep blue light output approaching violet and the blue is noticeably deeper than the 8000K.

Color Temperature: 12000K

12000K has an approximately 2100lm output, which is more than 2x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

This color temperature puts out a deep bluish violet light and is deeper colored than the 10000K. It is for someone who is looking for the most extreme and most exotic looking light output.

Sunlight has a Lumen rating of 100,000 per square meter of the earths surface.

 

[lagunak47]

Kelvin (K) A basic unit of thermodynamic temperature (color temperature) used to measure the whiteness of the light output. The higher the number is, the whiter the light is. When over 5000K the light begins to turn to blue as daylight.

The color temperature is purely a scale to measure the color of the light output.

Degrees Kelvin = ONLY COLOR

The reality is the higher up the scale, the less bright they become.

Lumen= BRIGHT

Color Temperature: 3000K (fog light use)

3000K has an approximately 3200lm output, which is more than 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

3000K emits GOLDEN YELLOW color and offers superior penetration power during adverse weather epically in dense fog.

Color Temperature: 4300K

4300K has an approximately 3200lm output, which is more than 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and is the color temperature with the most output.

The light appears fairly white, and has light yellowish hue when reflected off the road identical to the OEM HID equipped vehicles.

Color Temperature: 6000K

6000K has an approximately 2800lm output, which is 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and slightly less light output compared to the 4300K.

Although it has a bit lesser light output, it emits pure whiter light with very slight and barely noticeable tint of blue and purple.

Color Temperature: 8000K

8000K has an approximately 2550lm output, which is about 3x the light output of the traditional halogen light and slightly less light output compared to the 6000K.

While it has a bit lesser light output, it emits bluer light than the 6000K.

Color Temperature: 10000K

10000K has an approximately 2200lm output, which is more than 2x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

10000K produces a deep blue light output approaching violet and the blue is noticeably deeper than the 8000K.

Color Temperature: 12000K

12000K has an approximately 2100lm output, which is more than 2x the light output of the traditional halogen light.

This color temperature puts out a deep bluish violet light and is deeper colored than the 10000K. It is for someone who is looking for the most extreme and most exotic looking light output.

Sunlight has a Lumen rating of 100,000 per square meter of the earths surface.

thanks for adding that!

 

[lagunak47]

Those seem slightly off to me, maybe by 500-1000. I've read different #'s elsewhere before.

It's weird how our brains interpret things differently than they really are. I have 5k HID's and it looks nothing like the sun to me. It looks blue, especially when coming down the road (when above the cut off) and moreso when they're first turned on and warming up. 4100-4300 is the brightest possible for HID's and looks more like the sun than 5k.

Weird stuff indeed. Thanks for the post!

yea every light reads slightly different. We use a color temperature meter in my class to read kelvin. it would be interesting to read the ACTUAL kelvin of these lights, who knows maybe the companies don't match them up very well to what they say they are.

 

[JohnS.]

who knows maybe the companies don't match them up very well to what they say they are.

I have a feeling this is true amongst many, if not all, companies that manufacture aftermarket HID kits. Some claim to sell "30,000k" HID's and junk.

 

[lagunak47]

Update!!!

sooo i thought my hid's were very blue. had my cinematography professor use his $2000 color meter measure the actual kelvin temperature of the hids.
sooo

3200 - tungsten (houshold lighting)
5600 - Daylight

only a difference of 2000 kelvin between orange and whitish blue.

the "8000k" hids actually came out to over 32,000kelvin!!!!

that is about 26,000 degrees cooler than daylight

FALSE f**king ADVERTISING

You've been warned!

 

[leothelion]

sooo i thought my hid's were very blue. had my cinematography professor use his $2000 color meter measure the actual kelvin temperature of the hids.
sooo

3200 - tungsten (houshold lighting)
5600 - Daylight

only a difference of 2000 kelvin between orange and whitish blue.

the "8000k" hids actually came out to over 32,000kelvin!!!!

that is about 26,000 degrees cooler than daylight

FALSE f***ING ADVERTISING

You've been warned!

I think your friend needs a new meter...

Aslo...Kelvin...is not a measurement of color, its a temperature scale based around the principle of Absolute Zero using Celsius....high school science class guys...

Celsius to Kelvin

[°C] = [K] − 273.15

so 1000k is 726.84 C.....

Saying Kelvin is a color scale is like saying Celsius is a color scale...

Yes they uses Kelvin for HID ratings..but what they are rating is the TEMPERATURE....which just happens to correlate with a particular color of light.

They should really use Wavelengths to rate HID's...since you know...thats actually whats is there for an all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color

 

[Billy.]

That's what I hinted at in post #3. Just because a bulb is rated at 8000K does not necessarily mean it will have exactly the same color spectrum as a different brand bulb made with a different combination of innert gases also rated at 8000K... K is a temp, not a color code

 

[itsmycookie]

That's what I hinted at in post #3. Just because a bulb is rated at 8000K does not necessarily mean it will have exactly the same color spectrum as a different brand bulb made with a different combination of inert gases also rated at 8000K... K is a temp, not a color code

but when talking about HID lights Kelvin is only used as a color code. difference between manufacturers has nothing to do with it. it;s the same as difference between the same size shoe between brands. it doesn't change what the size means. they just aren't exact.

The color temperatures attributed to different types of lights are correlated based on visible colors matching a standard black body, and are not the actual temperature at which a filament burns.

So, why do we measure the hue of the light as a "temperature"? This was started in the late 1800s, when the British physicist William Kelvin heated a block of carbon. It glowed in the heat, producing a range of different colors at different temperatures. The black cube first produced a dim red light, increasing to a brighter yellow as the temperature went up, and eventually produced a bright blue-white glow at the highest temperatures. In his honor, Color Temperatures are measured in Kelvins.

Source: Digital Lighting & Rendering by Jeremy Birn