input shaft bearing question

[Jersey8]

alright im gonna be droppin my tranny this weekend. changin out the input shaft bearing and throw out bearing. i was lookin on hondapartsdeals.com and im not sure which bearing is the input shaft bearing. heres the link:

https://www.hondapartsdeals.com/honda_parts_list.php?hp_queried_components=0&hp_series_id=1531&hp_series_model=CIVIC&hp_series_year=1997&hp_series_door_ext_grade=3DR+CX&hp_series_transmission=5MT&hp_series_slsareacd=KA&hp_system=B&hp_component=M++01

can someone tell me which bearing i need? it looks like the ISB is #4 in the diagram and the oil seal is #7. am i correct? the thing is theres two #4's. does anybody know what the difference between these two are? and which one i should get? thanks.

EDIT* I included a second question in this thread. 6th post down. thanks guys EDIT*

EDIT* I included yet a THIRD QUESTION (haha sorry guys) in this thread. 2ne page, post #34 thanks EDIT* 3/11/06

 

[henkz0r]

You are correct. #4 = ISB, #7 = Input Shaft Oil Seal.

The only difference between those two #4 bearings is the mfg. They're both gonna be good, but I'd go for the NTN.

 

[vandynamics]

infamous HONDA ISB.

ive done 5+ ISB changes on various tranny's. its the byproduct of alot of engine breaking. thats why they go bad.

 

[Jersey8]

You are correct. #4 = ISB, #7 = Input Shaft Oil Seal.

The only difference between those two #4 bearings is the mfg. They're both gonna be good, but I'd go for the NTN.

alright awesome. exactly what i needed to know. thanks bro.

infamous HONDA ISB.

ive done 5+ ISB changes on various tranny's. its the byproduct of alot of engine breaking. thats why they go bad.

hmm, interesting ill def haveta keep that in mind once i get my new ISB in haha. thanks man

 

[henkz0r]

I've found that most ISBs go out because the owners NEVER CHANGE THE TRANS FLUID. They don't even consider that it needs to be replaced on a regular interval.

 

[Jersey8]

yea makes sense... im pretty sure there hasnt been tranny fluid in there for longer than 30k miles.

i have another question - well my ISB has been bad for awhile now probably like the last two months or so, but its been so cold lately ive been puttin it off. just this past weekend ive noticed that the chatter has gotten louder especially at idle/while in neutral. is it possible that me puttin off the ISB change could have caused other bearings to go to s**t? if so are there specific bearings that would usually go bad after the ISB? or would it vary? becuase id like to get my tranny done in a weekend, cuz i commute to work during the week.

thanks guys

 

[Jersey8]

bump for edit/second question haha

 

[vandynamics]

I've found that most ISBs go out because the owners NEVER CHANGE THE TRANS FLUID. They don't even consider that it needs to be replaced on a regular interval.

Theres no doubt about honda trannys being prone to having bad ISB's. I highly doubt its from people not changing their tranny fluid. If it were because of bad oil, you would see more bearings go bad at the same time the ISB goes bad.

Also your statement doesnt add up because people dont change their tranny fluid on all the cars regardless of the make. whether its honda, toyota, ford, or chevy. you dont see ISB's going bad like the honda's do

yea makes sense... im pretty sure there hasnt been tranny fluid in there for longer than 30k miles.

i have another question - well my ISB has been bad for awhile now probably like the last two months or so, but its been so cold lately ive been puttin it off. just this past weekend ive noticed that the chatter has gotten louder especially at idle/while in neutral. is it possible that me puttin off the ISB change could have caused other bearings to go to s**t? if so are there specific bearings that would usually go bad after the ISB? or would it vary? becuase id like to get my tranny done in a weekend, cuz i commute to work during the week.

thanks guys

No likely its not, you should be ok. but get it changed as soon as possible. in some extreme cases, a bad ISB can chew out the actual "seat" the bearing itself sits in. Your tranny magnet will look like complete s**t when you pull your tranny apart so be prepared for all that.

ill tell you, that magnet is one of the best things honda ever did to their trannys.

 

[henkz0r]

I've always been told that most manufacturers (Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Toyota, Nissan) use gear oil for their transmissions, which is a LOT thicker and more viscous. The oil doesn't get replaced nearly as often as the Honda (BMW uses lightweight motor oil too) transmission oils. The thicker weight improves oil life but decreases transmission performance (more resistance to rotation).

 

[vandynamics]

I've always been told that most manufacturers (Ford, Chevy, Dodge, Toyota, Nissan) use gear oil for their transmissions, which is a LOT thicker and more viscous. The oil doesn't get replaced nearly as often as the Honda (BMW uses lightweight motor oil too) transmission oils. The thicker weight improves oil life but decreases transmission performance (more resistance to rotation).

valid point. but honda's isb are definatly a design flaw. if and when you take a tranny apart you will see what im talking about. the gears are designed under acceleration to "pull" into each other and lock tigheter. when your engine breaking your doing the EXACT opposite of acceleration. in turn, this gives the gears a tendancy to pull the gears apart.

honda's logic = you will engine break 1/10000000000 the amount youll be accelerating (in the total life of the vehicle)

this just illustrates the different stresses "racing" or "performace" brings.

in my opinion a 30 dollar bearing every 80,000 miles is cheap. Especially when theres chewed synchros that need replaced.

 

[xxsenceo89x]

isb suck. first time i did mine i didnt knowhow to crack the case open. c clip ftl

 

[henkz0r]

honda's logic = you will engine break 1/10000000000 the amount youll be accelerating (in the total life of the vehicle)

this just illustrates the different stresses "racing" or "performace" brings.

I don't fully understand your statement. Would this mean to say that [H] never intended for us to engine break with any of their transmissions? Is that the design flaw? I'll warrant that 98% of the manual transmission driving populace doesn't engine brake. I'll bet that 75% of the [H] tuning population doesn't engine brake. On the other hand, I engine brake just about 99% of the time I decelerate. Am I killing my trans prematurely? I did a complete rebuild 63k ago and have had no issues with it (knocks on wood).

I've taken apart many [H] transmissions, but only put a small amount of brain time into figuring out the internal design of their transmissions. I always just write em off as F.M. f**kin' Magic.

 

[vandynamics]

excessive engine breaking will cause the ISB to go out faster. it takes about 80,000 miles though.

keyword: prematurley.

 

[Jersey8]

does anyone know if theres a DIY for the ISB change? cause i thought i saw one on here a month ago but now i cant find it.

EDIT* nvm found on on d-series.org. haha thanks guys

 

[SKATERANGELO]

hey bro can u please give me the link for the diy i have the same problem and i went to the shop and they want to charge me 900 to fix it .......thanks

 

[vandynamics]

heres a rough write up i did along time ago on a gsr trans. let me know if it helps

http://www.clubcivic.com/board/showthread.php?t=76436&highlight=ISB

 

[SKATERANGELO]

thanks bro Im a lil scared bacause i never repaired a tranny before but i prefer to do it my self with caution to pay 900 bucks for someone to do it ,the guy from the shop even told me that it was better 4 me 2 buy a new tranny insterd of repairing the noise .....

 

[SKATERANGELO]

heres a rough write up i did along time ago on a gsr trans. let me know if it helps

http://www.clubcivic.com/board/showthread.php?t=76436&highlight=ISB

but do u have the instructions of wat to do to remove the tranny like disconeccted the battery take the exhaust outor i dont know?

 

[Jersey8]

heres the one i found
http://www.d-series.org/forums/showthread.php?t=14079

 

[SKATERANGELO]

thanksalot bro !