Unforgivable Idle!!!!

[steviezee47]

So i swapped a b16a2 from a 2000 Civic Si into my 99 Ex. Ever since i did the swap it has a terrible idle. So the idle has been very erratic so I'm in the middle of trying to solve this damn problem. When the car has a cold start the idle bounces from 1000 to 3000. After the car is warmed up it will rev really around 2200 rpms and surge a bit when im at a red light.

Here is what i have done so far.....

I checked the vacuum, on the car with a vacuum gauge and it gave me solid reading. So with that Im going to assume that i dont have a vaccum leak. I am running the Edelbrock Perfromer X throttle body (http://www.edelbrock.com/sportcompact_new/mc/throttle_bodies/tb_perf.shtml). It came with the engine when i bought it and it appears to be in perfect condition. I checked to see if the bolts and nuts holding the throttle body to the intake manifold were good. I also bled the coolant. I thought the intake manifold was the suspect so i decided to install a skunk2 intake manifold but that didnt fix the problem. I cleaned out the IACV twice. I replaced the TPS sensor and have calibrated it correctly. I also tried another ecu and still no luck.

I did notice that when I took the intake pipe off and covered the bottom hole on the throttle body it idled perfect but once i took my finger off the hole it was idling around 2500- 3000

What am i forgetting!?!?!?!

 

[RonJ]

Any CEL codes? What ECU? Have you tried adjusting the idle speed?

 

[steviezee47]

No Cel. Its running a chipped ecu but it still acts the same on the p2t (b16a2 ecu). I also have adjusted the idle speed screw. I just made a discovery that the throttle body is meant for a GSR engine.

 

[JohnS.]

You're not supposed to just turn the idle screw whenever.

1. Warm up the car
2. Disconnect IACV and EVAP purge control solenoid valve
3. If engine stalls, restart the car and hold the RPM's up and slowly release the pedal to keep it running
4. According to the Helm's, idle should be around 450 + or - 50. If not, use the idle screw to adjust
5. Turn the car off
6. Reconnect the IACV and EVAP purge control solenoid valve
7. Reset the ECU
8. Start the car and it should be idling around 700 + or - 50 (according to Helms)

 

[RonJ]

You're not supposed to just turn the idle screw whenever.

1. Warm up the car
2. Disconnect IACV and EVAP purge control solenoid valve
3. If engine stalls, restart the car and hold the RPM's up and slowly release the pedal to keep it running
4. According to the Helm's, idle should be around 450 + or - 50. If not, use the idle screw to adjust
5. Turn the car off
6. Reconnect the IACV and EVAP purge control solenoid valve
7. Reset the ECU
8. Start the car and it should be idling around 700 + or - 50 (according to Helms)

John, just an FYI. This is the procedure for your engine, but it varies widely depending on your engine and ECU even among 6th generation Civics. In this case, the OP has a hybrid OBD2 engine/OBD1 ECU with a GSR throttle body.

 

[CivicxTree754]

You should spray some throttle cleaner or some sort of spray like that, all around the engine and intake and see if the idle drops. If that goes will it will eliminate the possiblity of a leak for sure or confirm one.

 

[steviezee47]

just to clarify, the throttle body is an edelbrock throttle body but it is for the gsr application. Also i have sprayed throttle body cleaner everywhere and nothing happened

I called edelbrock for some help and this is a direct quote from Edelbrock "We kinda got out of the sport compact thing" Damn jerk offs But he did say that i SHOULD be fine running the Edelbrock GSR throttle body on my b16a2

 

[steviezee47]

still idling like crazy

 

[travelingtom]

I did notice that when I took the intake pipe off and covered the bottom hole on the throttle body it idled perfect but once i took my finger off the hole it was idling around 2500- 3000

What am i forgetting!?!?!?!

did you replace the gasket for the throttle body? any small amount of air will cause it to idle weird

 

[steviezee47]

Yea i changed out the throttle body and intake manifold gasket

 

[RonJ]

Yea i changed out the throttle body and intake manifold gasket

Did you torque the nuts and bolts to spec?

 

[steviezee47]

Yes, everything is to torque spec. The idle stays at about 2000 when the car is warmed up, it will only surge if i give it some gas, in neutral. It also surges when the car is cold

 

[RonJ]

Does your GSR throttle body have an FITV attached at the bottom?

 

[steviezee47]

The throttle body is an Edelbrock throttle body Model # 4790 this is for gsr motors (it came with the engine swap). According to Edelbrock, i should be using model #4789 which is specifically for 99-00 Si engine. I called Edlebrock to see if this was a big deal not using the exact motor specific throttle body and they said it was fine, but they didnt sound confident at all when they said that

 

[RonJ]

Did you answer the question?

 

[steviezee47]

My apologies RonJ. I cant answer that question about the FITV with confidence so i took these pics










Also thanks for everyone who has given me a reply, I do appreciate it.

The more i look at it i, i believe it is a FITV. It has 3 bolts holding it to the throttle body. Im going to attempt to clean the FITV next and adjust that screw based on this write up http://www.honda-tech.com/showthread.php?t=1564019

 

[RonJ]

I can't tell from your pictures, but I do think you have one. Here's an FITV:

 

[steviezee47]

I do in fact have a FITV. I opened it up and the assembly was shaking around. I screwed it down and put it back on and the idle was a bit better. But it is still high around 1800 rpms and it still surges. I did notice that when the car was at operating temperature it was still sucking air from the lower hole in the throttle body. When i covered it up the idle dropped to a normal level but as soon as it was uncovered the idle jumped back up

The GSR throttle body is the culprit!!!! I will be replacing it with a skunk2 throttle body. I will update when it is installed.


BTW Edelbrock doesnt give a damn about Honda. The customer service blew ass, all they care about is domestic cars!!!

 

[RonJ]

Click the FITV link in my signature.

 

[Osiris19]

Your FITV needs to be cleaned or replaced as RonJ said. I just did this with my friends hatch. We swapped my FITV onto his car and it ran perfect. No surging and the idle was perfect.